September 2 2014, 12pm
Yeah, I think I agree. I just don’t want anybody to feel stunted by gender. Also i apologise, I wasn’t aware you were wary of such topics, which is why I was so casual with asking about them.
It’s cool, I’ve just had bad experiences with flamewars about these things in the past, that’s all. ^^ There’s a lot of opinions floating around on tumblr that I find far too clear-cut and radical and can’t support at all… so I’d rather not discuss these things too much. It’s not your fault~
September 2 2014, 11am
spiderbread replied to your post “spiderbread said: If it were me, I’d have made the protagonist…”
Do you think there’s anyway to realistically portray a gender-fluid character in such a setting? It’s something I’ve thought about but never grasped any solid ideas.
No, I will be blunt, I do not believe it is outright possible, for the simple reason that this is a concept not widespread in society, regardless of how much the internet tries to propagate it. Naturally, it is possible to make a character who simply doesn’t *care* for gender - a good example is Haruhi Fujioka from Ouran High School Host Club, who outright states she differentiates little between genders and is perfectly comfortable with assuming roles of either gender - but these characters would be unlikely to outright refer to themselves as agender, genderfluid or the likes, simply because these are concepts both the audience and most other characters in-universe would simply not be familiar with and that would thus only over-complicate the situation by bringing them up. Most societies still have little of a concept of such identities, if I brought these terms up here in Austria, where I lived, or in Japan, nobody would know what I was talking about. It is much easier to say “X is a woman but doesn’t care about being a woman or a man either way.” than to go into a long-winded, complex and even professionally heavily debated definition of different gender-identities which could fill a whole encyclopedia.
(And if you try to go and mention Zoe Hange from SnK now:
1.) SnK is set in a post-apocalyptic scenario with a society blended of hundreds of cultures, which works on wastly different rules from our, and additionally, the setting is highly military and people only care less for gender because they have much, much worse problems to deal with in first place.
2.) Zoe Hange’s gender is “canonically open for interpretation”, according to the Mangaka. That is not exactly the same as canonically being any set gender identity at all, not even agender or genderfluid.
3.) This is all I am going to say on this topic; I am not going to go into discussions about SnK now because that fandom can be as dangerous as Pandora’s box from my experience.)
Change has to happen naturally and society needs to change naturally. We cannot try to shape society by jumping ahead too far in the media by integrating ideals that are not yet reality into otherwise close-to-realistic portrayals of society. That only causes confusion and alienation in those not yet familiar with the concepts. Rather, it is better to ease people into such ideas, with characters and scenarios who simply cause us to question what the distinction between male and female gender roles is even good for and if it can even be applied to all people. In my honest opinion, it is always much better to make people question and rethink concepts already existing in their minds than to just feed them completely new information in an uncritical way, allowing them to be passive about it.
September 2 2014, 6am
Catherine uses the Gamebryo engine which is 3rd party. Atlus said it will use a new engine. Though that interview is years old, so who knows.
Ahhh, that makes more sense now!
OK, thanks a lot! Hmmm, that makes me wonder what the graphics in P5 will look like… :-3c
September 2 2014, 6am
// I forget if it's true and I think you're the best person to ask for confirmation - ive heard a long time ago that the Naoto novel isn't considered canon. Is that right? I just want to be clear on this lmao.
I heard it was originally supposed to be Canon, but un-canon’d after a lot of fans had complained about the storyline and how it was executed. Apparently, the story was originally based on a draft by Katsura Hashino, but the writer who executed the draft did it so poorly that Hashino was fully ready to un-canon it when fans demanded so.
Of course, that’s only rumors I heard. I cannot give any sources that are any more reliable than mouth-to-mouth, so take this with a grain of salt, please.
September 2 2014, 5am
spiderbread said: If it were me, I’d have made the protagonist androgynous and their gender would be whatever the player wanted. No selection, it just is what you want it to be.
Unfortunately, this would greatly limit the storytelling that could be done with this kind of story, since Persona has always tried to realistically portray human interaction in one way or another, and the fact of things is just that people react differently to a male than they react to a female in many situation. Even if the character were fully androgynous, at very least how people around them interact with them would have some gendered aspects in the Japanese version. The whole reason P3P had a female MC in it was to explore this fact. People in Japan just talk differently to women than they’d talk to men and the speed relationships develop differs between genders as well. In fact, that’s not only true for Japan; the world just has a lot of gender barriers still in place.
In a fantasy game, building a world where no differences are made between gender is much easier and that kind of concept could work and would be quite fun. But in Persona, this would throw a wrench into the realistic portrayal of human interactions in today’s society. They are trying to portray something we can relate to in our everyday lives and not an ideal, after all.
September 2 2014, 5am
Atlus built their own engine. They confirmed that sometime after the release of Catherine.
That’s no the question, though. The question was if they built a wholly new engine *again* or just used the existing one from Catherine.
September 1 2014, 8pm
Just curious, what're your thoughts on Persona 5 apparently being set in Shibuya? (Which is not only a city like in the first 3 Persona games, but also a place that exists in the real world?)
With the theme they’re going with, I think it’s ingenious!
From what I’ve learned about Japanese society(and this can apply to any society really), they’re set on certain norms that pretty much incapacitates people and traps them in hollow lifestyles. It’s said that people are expected to work 40+ hours over there! It’s not just the working world that has problems but just their way of living. Japanese are told not to fuss, to keep everything inside and to keep peace for the sake of the whole. They’re not expected to be rebellious, to stand up, to be an individual; it’s either abide by traditions and rules or you’ll be outcasted. That’s why suicides happen, why bullying isn’t addressed as it should be, why there’s a lack of a gay community and so many other things. If this is what P5 will be tackling, then it would make sense to have it in a real location within an overpopulated city. It’s gonna be one controversial topic but when has Atlus ever been afraid of controversy?
At least, that’s what I’ve gathered from those who live or experienced life in Japan. Anyone’s welcomed to correct me on anything I’ve got wrong.
Much more than just that, Shibuya is a great symbol of recent developments in urbane, Japanese society, and how they are both positive and negative.
Japanese Youth has become more open, more rebellious and more in need for individual forms of expression in recent years, which is why you’ll see far more diversity especially on urban streets these days. However, the issue with that is the question of how much of it is really genuine individuality, and how much is just fitting into chastes of trends and styles again? Shibuya is a perfect example of that, a town painted by a young society that comes in apparently greatly diverse styles, but in the end, these styles are determined by trends, by fashion, by the opinions of the masses; you think you are expressing individuality, but actually, you are just expressing a fashion forged by a collective again.
That’s why Shibuya has become so popular a setting for stories that practise criticism consumerism and identity-concepts in modern Japan, one example well known in gaming being “The World Ends With You”. It just suits these topics perfectly.
You can probably also see why it goes well with Persona 5’s predicted topics as well in this case, right?